PlayAbly Podcast Episode 13: Crafting the Perfect Interactive Experience with PlayAbly’s Head of UX

In this episode of the PlayAbly podcast, we’re joined by Seema, PlayAbly’s Head of UX and Game Design. Seema works directly with customers to help them shape the games and interactive experiences that boost engagement. Today, she shares insights into balancing client ideas with best UX practices, designing games that work for different customer personas, and solving specific business challenges through gamified solutions. From casual game mechanics to detailed customer feedback, Seema gives us a look at how PlayAbly creates personalized interactive journeys that customers love.

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Transcript

PlayAbly Podcast Episode 10: Crafting the Perfect Interactive Experience with Playably’s Head of UX, Seema

[00:00:00] 

Kajal: Welcome to the Playably podcast. Today we have Seema joining us, who is our head of UX and game design. Seema deals directly with customers, helps them figure out what games we're going to interactives we want to do.

Welcome, Seema. 

Seema: Hello, thanks for having me again. this is the most fun of my job. I'm glad. I was thinking about some corrections one of our clients suggested. and I think one of the things that's very hard about a lot of UX.

is that it's meant to be invisible. people think I could just change that button. They're always giving me UX tips that are against good UX practice because they read top to bottom on a website because it's their own brand. almost every customer scrolls and only scans.

And so they can't understand how to make it better because they don't know what's going on. But games, everybody plays games and everybody understands it, so the feedback they give and [00:01:00] the ideas they have are both actionable and appropriate. 

Kajal: I know everybody always says I have an idea for a game and then dives into, whatever they're imagining we've heard everything all over the gamut.

So how do you balance those initial ideas about what they want with what's going to work for their audience? 

Seema: So I think first, listen. I used to think this when I had very small children at home, they just need to share sometimes. people need to share.

I think it's really important to listen and hear what they're saying. sometimes it's not what they're saying, but what they're meaning to say. sometimes it's this frustration and a lot of times people don't realize why the sales aren't converting, but they do understand the frustration customers are having.

So maybe they think, the return rate is high because sizing is a problem when the return rate might be high because you're not telling them how it should fit. It's not that the size is the problem, it's that [00:02:00] they're expecting something different. And so when you listen to them, and ask them some really good probing questions, you find out maybe the game should actually be not about, what size you fit, but how it looks on a human body.

maybe you didn't know that it was supposed to be loose. This happens a lot with brands. It's supposed to run loose, or tight, and they can't communicate that Texturally, that sounds weird, but visually it's clear, If I said, it's supposed to be tight, 

But if I said it hugs the hips in a certain way, and showed you a picture that would make sense. it's definitely listening. It's also reminding them, because once you give them the opening they're gonna go. So then you can also, put things in a parking lot.

That's a great idea. How about we solve this problem first, Get really good buy in and then do the bigger problem. I think those are the two big things. 

Kajal: a lot of times the client focuses on multiple problems. How do you choose which problem you want to focus on? 

Seema: I am a pragmatist by nature, so I think you should solve the problem that is either the [00:03:00] easiest to solve or the most pressing.

They're almost always the same one. Because your most pressing problem probably could be solved pretty easily. sometimes the problem is people cannot see the difference between two colors. This is actually pretty common. I notice this in, makeup and clothing brands.

Most people are not very attuned to color. they return it because it was red and then it turns out it's a red that's more cool or more warm. when you figure out the return rate is their biggest problem. and you figure out the solution, it's almost always an easy solution.

It's almost just saying, here's a find the difference game. Here's a color matching game. both are very easy games. We have those mechanisms at our fingertips. that's usually my first step. The second step is to say, how about we solve this part of the problem, and chunk it.

sometimes especially for repeat customers, you can solve parts of the problem in a repeat way, which also solves a different problem you might not be thinking about, which is, allegiance to your brand. 

Kajal: how much [00:04:00] does the mechanics of the game come into play with different audiences?

Is it most audiences will play any game, or how do you figure that out? 

Seema: That's a great question. Experience is how we figure that out. we know better than to reinvent the wheel every time. if you think about, transportation.

Some people need cars, some people need buses, some people walk. we're not trying to change their behaviors, but if they're most likely gonna walk, we're gonna solve them in the walking way. Sometimes people think this breaks down by, age, but it actually breaks down by habit.

somebody who is a very, casual shopper does not want an in depth game. Somebody who is a shopper because they want to validate their knowledge. These are often high AOV products too. they want to be the person who gets the best. we work with a brand that does, high end speakers. Those people want to be validated in their knowledge. So their game is going to be more knowledge based. it's about personas [00:05:00] and UX and making sure that we understand the UX and then build a mechanism that builds on something they already love.

Kajal: What if the brand doesn't have personas yet? 

Seema: One of the great things about us is that we use data. I've done personas for many years, traditionally through user experience and research, but it takes a long time.

now that we work with big data, it speeds it up. within two weeks, we can chunk all your data, look at your competitors data and build solid personas. 

Kajal: Are you seeing any trends in types of games people are requesting or the ones that are the most popular?

Seema: Yeah, I think what's funny is people are requesting one kind of game and then when they play our arcade games They're playing a different one. So one of the big trends is forgetting that your customers aren't you. a lot of people want these very in depth games, because they want their customers to go deep in their brand immediately, but when they start playing games, they see they want these casual games themselves [00:06:00] and that their customers enjoy the casual games.

I think people, once the window is open to them, see they can have an ecosystem of games, which is what we advocate. more than one game, doing it differently, doing them for product launches, people love the casual games because they're foolproof, right?

like Plinko, Play, Pinball, Matching, Candy Crush, anybody can do 

Kajal: sometimes I find myself testing the games for way longer than they should be. 

Seema: Every time I do a meeting I keep playing while I'm talking. I can't stop myself. Once we get that leaderboard, I'm sure you'll be at the top of it.

our founder, John is always like, how did you figure that one out? And I was like, I don't know. I've built games for, more than two decades. really complicated board games, like role playing games, I wouldn't say that, I am a natural at playing video games.

I don't always win our games, even though I can make a game that people want to win. I've always, that's what I've done for a living. I come out of [00:07:00] design, and visuals, not out of, gameplay. it is very funny that I even have one that I'm good at so it always cracks me up.

I think the other thing you just said is really important all of the games draw a different kind of person. for me being on the leaderboard, I could care less for some people. it is about competition. And for some people it's like that one. Cause it's actually about patterns.

And for some people, pattern recognition is really important Like we have a game about our favorite stuffed animal, eating apples, and that's fun for some people. brands should understand all of these people shop with them.

Kajal: Can you share a specific example when customer input significantly shaped the direction that they're interactive? 

Seema: Yeah, absolutely. So we have, one of the things I think is so interesting is hearing from a brand. What's been hard for them? Because that's a great place to start.

So we're working with an outdoor furniture brand. and I admit I haven't purchased a lot of outdoor furniture. so we always work with these new brands. they're not [00:08:00] problems I've had to solve, which I love, right? Cause we love hearing about new problems.

one of their problems is when you buy outdoor furniture online, people misunderstand scale. Which, I would do that, for sure. 

Kajal: that. 

I always wonder the wrong sides of something. 

Seema: That's right! They said it happens all the time, it's human. And the other thing that I said to them, because once they explained their problem, I try to, understand the problem even before we do persona research.

My problem is, when you say something is this size by this size, I don't know what that means. You see the numbers and you're like, what does that mean? So we talked through this problem and originally they wanted does this furniture match with this furniture? So like rattan and then you see glass and they wanted like a matching game.

certainly that could be the next level. but people just don't even know if it fits. They said, yes, that is our first problem. So we created a game balanced between both elements. it is a puzzle, where you put pieces together, and it indicates, those really work well together.

Or, this chair would also be [00:09:00] good. Our games, are very different from others. I came out of educational games, so it's somewhat similar, but still different from traditional games.

you don't want anyone to feel like, even if you lose, you have to win. So we can't be like, That looks ugly! Which is what they wanted originally. we have to instead come up with it. But it was a really good example of Where they told us their need, then they told us their idea, and then we blended it together to create a game that solves both their need and their idea.

and it'll be fun! on our end, it's a lot of infrastructure. I was working with the game developer this morning, and I was saying it's like a branching structure, right? But it's so much better than them doing, textual explanation. in their store, they have one of those, like a sectional, basically.

It's like a rattan sectional. That looks huge. in the picture. But when you see the size, a lot of these rattan things are actually smaller in real size. And that's something where they couldn't describe it well, right? Because you have to ship it, so it's obviously not going to be [00:10:00] giant. but it's really easy when you see it just go into the slot in the little pattern.

Kajal: internalize it. 

Seema: you understand it without having to be explained. 

Kajal: How have we seen these games perform when it comes to customer loyalty and retention? 

Seema: One thing that is great is that people gain an affinity to the brand by the play, and play is already such a powerful tool, right?

we're at the season of Halloween, and Halloween is a big part of it. really a gamified experience, right? I don't know a child, who doesn't compete about how much candy you got, both of them have jobs, they could buy candy, one of them drives a car.

Like they don't need to get Halloween candy. so that's a gamified experience. So I think already you're getting affinity just from the idea that you've done something different than other people. But the other thing I think that this really does is particularly like our advent calendar is that it brings you back over and over.

And then also with even like our. Playco game, which is just a dropping like [00:11:00] Plinko. when, you're changing it up, you're giving them this positive feedback loop that they've checked in again. And so I think that a lot of brands right now with the economy, how it is, it's up and down.

We don't know what's going to go on. they have to seem different and they have to seem like they care more. 

Kajal: And 

Seema: then I think the final thing is like, are this or that game, for example, many of our games actually have personas in them and they invite you to make choices. Like you can choose your character to go on the maze 

Something a lot of brands aren't giving you. Choice, Even though you get to pick your products, they don't really care what you pick, 

any signal that you're listening to them is huge 

Kajal: and rewarding for interacting more and being able to offer a more personalized experience. I get how that would be attractive. I'm so glad you mentioned the advent calendar.

I don't think we've actually talked about that on the podcast. Do you mind just describing that? 

Seema: I love it. we've been calling it an advent calendar. I want to say publicly that because everyone's thinking about Q1, [00:12:00] it can be an anything calendar. You should just think of it as a launch tool.

obviously, because we're working on advent calendars for Black Friday, that's why we've been calling it the advent calendar. one of those things we all know from childhood is counting down the days, How many days till spring break?

How many days till summer? How many days for Christmas? Whatever faith you come from, you have ticked down the days for something. Being able to cross that off is one thing, but to get a prize after you cross off that day is even better. And so the Advent Calendar is basically, inviting people to learn more about your brand.

Every day you can do it. You can do it five days in a row. I think it would be great for Valentine's Day. You could do something early enough that they can get the thing to ship before Valentine's Day. it's really fun. you sign in and you get more discounts the more days you participate. we can build it out for 30 days. I don't know many brands would need a 30 day calendar, but we can do that. I think the ideal is five to seven days. That's perfect 

Kajal: coming [00:13:00] back every week 

Seema: Oh, yeah, so that's another thing we can do like a weekly.

I was thinking about for summertime, for example Every day of summer you could do something, I think absolutely. for brands that are earth friendly earth month you could absolutely do that.

Kajal: sustainability brands 

Seema: each reminder, would send an email linking to a website with a calendar. They'd click on the day of the event Then there would be.

 a small extension. like a short, game (candy crush, shell game, etc). Each would take about 10 seconds, and if they win, they get something.

If they lose, they still get something. Remember, we're not alienating anybody. the key would be that they remember you. Because one of the really tough things is, you've been sending them newsletters all the time. And they probably aren't doing what you're asking them. This incentivizes them to do what you ask.

Kajal: a great way to get people to sign up for the emails is to have them log in to get their reward and keep it tracking. I can imagine that's a great way [00:14:00] to boost that. 

Seema: Oh, absolutely. I was talking to someone about the advent calendar and we were talking about, huge rates of returns, to the product because people want to win.

It goes back to Halloween, right? People want to get the most candy. 

Kajal: once you start something, you're more likely to continue and finish it rather than just doing it once and stopping. 

Seema: Interesting. 

Kajal: So what happens after the interactive?

where does the customer go? 

Seema: So this goes back to the beginning of what we were talking about. the brand needs to decide on what they want to happen while we plan the game. for the advent calendars, for example, you really want to focus every time you should be sending them to the product in the game.

That is also the product that's on, your Black Friday deal or your new product for Valentine's Day. you have to decide on the end before you start the beginning, which is the game. that's the first thing you always want to make it so that once they're done with the game, they have something to [00:15:00] spend their discount on.

you basically want to make it as easy as possible for them to purchase after that. usually we have to go to a landing page with a product or a collection page, let's say your game has five products on it with some, congratulations, you got a discount and here's the things you get. you don't want to make it hard in any way, shape or form for them to buy the thing you just showed them.

Kajal: Thinking about the future, five years in the future, where would you like to see this concept? 

Seema: Wow, that's a really tough question. I think that as a shopper, not as a game designer, I would love to see brands using this online shopping has become rote.

I'm old enough that I remember when we didn't have online shopping. I remember the beginning of Amazon, and how excited everyone was, customers who liked this bought, also bought this. My dad is a complete sucker for that.

They say I like this. I remember one of our teachers in school being like, yeah, that's just an algorithm. I think my math teacher actually. people were a sucker for that. [00:16:00] now lots of every brand has, recommendations based on what you purchased.

And I would love to see more brands leaning into this because actually what it does is it gives customers. More engagement. So they're getting to be able to make their choices in a better way, in a more fun way. and I also think that the other thing it could do is allow brands to have more ability to discount correctly, because I think what they're doing is that we have a brand that has like a 40 percent off right now.

and they had it last month too. we were saying, that sounds bad. But what if they could do it based on the customer? somebody who came in has played a lot of games, gets 40 percent off. Somebody who has never come in and is most likely not to shop and has never showed up on your leaderboard, they get 20 percent off.

There's no point in wasting 40 percent off on them. They will never come back. 

Kajal: That makes a really good point thinking about the individual journeys for your customers and how that can [00:17:00] be differentiated and then automated. 

Seema: automation is the future. 

Kajal: I know I'm automating whatever I can.

Soon the podcast will be nominated. And maybe nominated for something. I'm sure there's a best podcast award. We're definitely gonna win it. Thank you Seema. I really enjoyed this conversation. And hopefully everyone listening has learned a lot. don't forget to check out Playably if you haven't.

We have demos and first month free by mentioning the podcast. 

Seema: That's right. Thank you